This month is all about Talent as Al speaks with Moneris’ Talent Acquisition team about the candidate experience. Al is also joined by Michelle Slater, Senior Director North American Marketing at Indeed. Michelle shares some data and provides her tips on how to improve the candidate experience.
This month is all about Talent as Al speaks with Moneris’ Talent Acquisition team about the candidate experience.
Al is also joined by Michelle Slater, Senior Director North American Marketing at Indeed. Michelle shares some data and provides her tips on how to improve the candidate experience.
Also in this episode:
Links of Interest
Al Grego:
Coming up on Shop Talk.
Michelle Slater:
74% of new jobs on Indeed in Canada include pay information in the job description. And more importantly, jobs that have listed the salary get two times the amount of applications than jobs that don't have it.
Al Grego:
Hello everyone. I'm Al Grego.
Jacqueline Campbell:
And I'm Jacqueline Campbell.
Al Grego:
And this is the May 2023 edition of Shop Talk with Moneris. Welcome to the Shop Talk podcast, Jacqueline.
Jacqueline Campbell:
Thanks for having me, Al.
Al Grego:
My pleasure. So Jacqueline, did you know that I can play a little guitar?
Jacqueline Campbell:
No, I don't think I-
Al Grego:
I sing as well.
Jacqueline Campbell:
Good for you. But what does that have to do with this podcast?
Al Grego:
I'm pretty good at whistling too. You want to hear?
Jacqueline Campbell:
Maybe some other talk? Al?
Al Grego:
Yeah.
Jacqueline Campbell:
What's going on?
Al Grego:
What do you mean?
Jacqueline Campbell:
Why does it sound like you're auditioning for something?
Al Grego:
I'm just sharing my talents with you.
Jacqueline Campbell:
I appreciate it, but why?
Al Grego:
Well, you're on the talent acquisition team at Moneris, right?
Jacqueline Campbell:
Yes. But that's not the type of talent we're looking for here.
Al Grego:
It's not.
Jacqueline Campbell:
No, sorry.
Al Grego:
Not even the whistling.
Jacqueline Campbell:
Especially not the whistling.
Al Grego:
Oh, okay. Well, your loss then, I guess.
Jacqueline Campbell:
I guess so.
Al Grego:
All kidding aside, Jacqueline. It's May and for the second year in a row, we're talking about talent acquisition this month.
Jacqueline Campbell:
That's right.
Al Grego:
And as our expert on the subject, I asked you to help me produce this episode.
Jacqueline Campbell:
Yes. And I really appreciate the opportunity.
Al Grego:
So what do you have lined up for me this month?
Jacqueline Campbell:
Well, first you're going to chat with our senior manager of talent acquisition here at Moneris, Josh Dunton. He's going to explain why the candidate experience matters, and how companies can level up during their recruitment processes.
Al Grego:
Okay. That'll be timely information considering today's job marketplace.
Jacqueline Campbell:
Definitely. And then we have Michelle Slater joining us from Indeed to share some numbers that might help inform businesses looking to hire top talent.
Al Grego:
Michelle was on with us last year. I'm really looking forward to catching up with her. But first, let's begin with my chat with Josh.
Speaker 4:
Featured interview.
Al Grego:
Joined by Josh Dunton. He's the senior manager of talent Acquisition at Moneris. Josh, thank you so much for joining me today.
Josh Dunton:
No problem. Thank you for having me.
Al Grego:
So this month's theme is talent acquisition, and specifically you're here to talk to me about the candidate experience. So let's start with the obvious question. What's a candidate experience? What does that mean?
Josh Dunton:
It's really the candidate's perspective of the employer's recruiting process. So that's basically from the moment they're engaged all the way through the hiring process until the journey ends at either being declined or getting offered to join the company. So it's your job application process, your interview process, any communications you have throughout, and any follow-ups that happen.
Al Grego:
Okay. So why is this important to focus on this right now?
Josh Dunton:
I think for two reasons. One, it directly impacts the reputation of the organization. And so having a great candidate experience, people think more highly of your company, and number two, it allows you to hire top talent by having a great candidate experience.
Al Grego:
I guess it's important. I mean, that's what companies are competing with each other on now, right? Is finding good talent.
Josh Dunton:
I think sometimes people don't realize the edge you can get by having that great experience, because a negative experience will make the decision process easier for candidates to select themselves out. They won't feel as excited about the opportunity that they're getting there, whereas a positive one will have them feeling great about not just the organization, but the team they're joining and the impact they're going to have, and can help push the needle that last little bit to get them over the line, in the door.
Al Grego:
So as an organization you're trying to improve, what should you be looking for in your own candidate experience to make sure it's positive?
Josh Dunton:
I mean, the first thing you should do is go through the candidate journey. So put yourself in the candidate's shoes, apply for a job at your company, whether that through your own job board or if you have a sandbox environment and your software, do that. But go through the hiring process, from the application through what it looks like to schedule interviews through your team and what the offer experience looks like. Even if you want to go so far as onboarding, that's important as well. I think by understanding their perspective, you can figure out where there are areas to be improved. And that usually means having prompt follow up, having a fast, efficient process that is easy for candidates to navigate. It's not duplications. I see a lot of processes where you apply with your resume, and then you have to fill in all the information again, that's on your resume.
Al Grego:
Oh, I hate that. Yeah.
Josh Dunton:
Yeah. So removing those sorts of blockers for candidates will make it a much more enjoyable experience from the application side. And then making sure that your recruitment team is consistently engaging with candidates to make sure they have ideas on the timeline, feedback for each step of the journey, and what to expect.
Al Grego:
Now, once you've identified these areas of improvement, how can an employer make these changes? What would you suggest?
Josh Dunton:
Yeah, so I think for the easy ones, say the duplication and application process, just remove those steps, if you can, from your applicant tracking system. And for the interview process, I think the first step is going to be documenting what your process looks like to make sure that you understand it from end-to-end, and then just start making those changes and communicating those to either your team or the business of the changes that you're making. And I think it's really just avoiding the common mistakes that you would typically make in the recruiting process that creates a bad experience.
Al Grego:
Keeping it simple is really important.
Josh Dunton:
Yeah, definitely.
Al Grego:
So do you have any examples of how you could streamline the application process?
Josh Dunton:
The easiest thing to do is if you're not using the application tracking system to invest in one. I know that's not always easy for everyone if you're a smaller company to do that, but applicant tracking system really helps streamline everything by keeping the application flow in line, allowing candidates to track their application status throughout, and even providing automation for your internal team to schedule easier, communicate through templates easier that are personalized, just a way to continue to engage candidates throughout the process. And then if you're not investing a lot of money into these solutions, you can also use it as a CRM, a customer relationship management tool to keep in touch with candidates who have been in the process that you want to engage in the future.
Al Grego:
Interesting. And so it also provides, I guess, a template and kind of standardizes your application, so it's always the same experience throughout.
Josh Dunton:
Yep. It'd be the same experience for everyone, and you could keep tweaking it too, right? That's the way you can add different questions in the beginning or provide more upfront information. I think what the key from the applicant tracking system, what it'll do is automate a lot of those communications. So once somebody applies, they'll get an email telling them the application's been received and what to expect next. And you can customize that for your own process. And so that keeps candidates in the know, to what to expect and when. And then also those templates can be created to be used to schedule interviews or talk about what next stages are in the process. And so instead of having to create something new every time from the recruitment side, you're able to keep in touch with Candace at a click of a button and give him those updates.
Al Grego:
What about interviews? I mean, it might be a bit ironic, but I hate job interviews despite me being an interviewer on podcasts, job interviews are my least favorite part of the process. Well, do you have any kind of tips or suggestions for the interview portion?
Josh Dunton:
I think two things. So one I think is to do video interviewing when possible. I know we're sort of in this world now where sometimes we're in office, sometimes we're not. But I think with video interviews, what makes it easy is that the candidate is always in a comfortable environment. They're at home, they've got their coffee, their tea or whatever. It just feels nicer than having to go into an office and worry about parking or traffic or all those things. I still think that puts people at ease. I think one of the easiest things that I don't see a lot when I'm shadowing individuals is just putting people at ease in the interview. Spend that first five minutes, small talk, talking to the candidate, getting them comfortable. I feel so many times, because we're short on time, we jump right into questions, and then you don't have that opportunity to get to know that person, help settle their nerves before you start diving into all their work experience.
Al Grego:
One of my pet peeves about applying for a job anywhere is I submit my application, it goes into the ether, and then I may never hear from that employer again. What's the importance there of good communication?
Josh Dunton:
I think that's the key to having a great candidate experience. I've been recruiting for a long time, and one thing I noticed is that the bar is super low for what people expect from recruiters, which is terrible for me being in that profession. So for me, I always give feedback to candidates I interview, and that's usually detailed feedback. So I'll usually send them an email first telling them that we're not moving forward, and then I will give them the opportunity to schedule time with me to talk through that feedback. A lot of times candidates will say, I never received feedback like this, this never happens, and they really appreciate it, and that's a great time for me to create a relationship with them for the future in case they're interested in the company again, or just provided their great experience. At the same time, I also will at least email every candidate that applies who is not being selected, so that at least they know it's just not some black hole of applications. And they think like, oh, maybe Moneris will interview me still.
It's been six months since I applied. I haven't heard back. That role is long closed. So as soon as I review their resume, and I'm not moving forward, I'll typically let them know, so that they can sort of close that one-off, and focus on the job search parts that matter for them.
Al Grego:
Yeah, the worst feeling there is learning that you missed that on a good opportunity, because you thought it was gone, and you moved on to something else.
Josh Dunton:
Yeah.
Al Grego:
So you mentioned an applicant tracking system. So there are tools out there and companies that businesses can leverage to improve their candidate experience. Do you have any examples?
Josh Dunton:
Yeah, so at Moneris we use Workday as our applicant tracking system, but in the past I've used Lever Greenhouse smart recruiters, and they all come with different benefits and things that don't work well, but all of them basically just help you streamline your process. And so some of them are lightweight. So if you're a smaller company, and you don't need a super robust system that connects and integrates with everything, you can find those and they're cheaper. Or you can get an all-in-one Workday, which we use, which every team across HR at Moneris is using.
Al Grego:
All right. And final question. I mean, Moneris puts a lot of time and effort into improving this experience. In your past experience, can you tell us about a time where you saw the positive impact of improving the candidate experience?
Josh Dunton:
I think for me, the positive I've seen from candidate experience comes back to feedback. And so for candidates that I've provided feedback to and connected on the phone and given them that advice, typically because it was personalized, and I give them specific advice, they'll try to action that if they're interested in working at the company again. And so there's been multiple times in my career where find candidates apply again in six months or a year, has addressed the gaps they had in their experience, and had been hired by the company. And I think that without that feedback loop, those candidates would've given up on working at that company or tried for a different team. And I look at every opportunity whether it was feedback or anything to create that relationship between the candidate and the organization, so that we can hire them in the future.
And I always say, it's not we're never going to hire you. Right now, it's not the right fit. And so in the future, we should reassess your experience, that's how it works. And I think by providing that positive candidate experience, it brings candidates back into reviewing your organization to work there at some point in the future.
Al Grego:
You haven't closed that door. There's a possibility in the future,
Josh Dunton:
But if you don't get feedback, you do close that door, because that candidate's got such a poor experience. And I've been there before where I've had a poor experience in the process, and I've just not ever looked at that company again to work at despite how big they were and successful. It just wasn't something I wanted to do.
Al Grego:
Same thing. I was interviewing with the company, left a bad taste in my mouth, and my overall opinion of that company then gets tarnished.
Josh Dunton:
Yeah, it lasts a career too, right? It's 20 years later and you're still like, ah, I don't really want to assess that opportunity. No, thanks.
Al Grego:
Yeah, exactly. Okay. Thank you so much for your time today, Josh.
Josh Dunton:
Thank you for having me.
Cass McPhee:
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Speaker 4:
By the numbers.
Al Grego:
I'm joined by Michelle Slater. She's a senior director of North American Marketing at Indeed. Michelle, thank you so much for coming back on podcast.
Michelle Slater:
It's great to be be back.
Al Grego:
Now, you were on last year around this time again to talk about talent acquisition, and this month the theme is talent acquisition once again. First of all, let's talk about Indeed. What does Indeed do?
Michelle Slater:
Indeed, is Canada's largest job platform. It's where people can go and post that they're looking for someone that they want to hire to join their organization, and it's also where Canadians can go and put their resume up and look for a job.
Al Grego:
Now, you're on today by the numbers segment. So do you have a data point for me that we could discuss?
Michelle Slater:
I sure do. The top data point I want to share today is 74% of new jobs on Indeed in Canada include pay information in the job description, and more importantly, jobs that have listed the salary get two times the amount of applications than jobs that don't have it.
Al Grego:
That makes complete sense. I don't know. It's so annoying when you go for a job and only later do you find out what the salary expectation is, probably wouldn't have gone for it to begin with if you'd known.
Michelle Slater:
It's disappointing on both sides. It's for job seekers who think, hey, this is how much I'm going to make. And also it wastes people's time. It wastes the job seeker's time, but it's also frustrating for employers. They might interview someone and go through several steps and rounds before they get to a salary expectation and realize that it's a mismatch. So there needs to be some negotiation of course, but having pay be transparent helps to close the pay gap, makes it easier and actually makes it a lot faster as well for both the employer and the job seeker.
Al Grego:
We're talking a lot about the candidate experience in this episode. How would you define the candidate experience?
Michelle Slater:
The candidate experience starts at the very beginning when you actually have your job posting. But when you think about candidate experience overall, it's what the job seeker thinks and perceives about your company and their brand that you stand for throughout the entire process. So that includes recruitment process, the hiring process, the job posting, as I mentioned, how easy is it to fill out the application, right? Phone calls, interactions with recruiters. It's all the steps from the very beginning of job posting throughout the entire experience, trying to get hired at a particular company.
Al Grego:
Do you have anything to say about what the job market is right now? Is it still tilted toward the job seeker or is it kind of more in the middle, or what would you say?
Michelle Slater:
I'd say the current job market has slowed down in the last six to nine months in Canada, but there are still many opportunities out there for people depending on the industry that they want to work in as well as where they are based. So depending on where you are in Canada, what type of skillset you have, the type of job you're looking for, it can still be an incredibly hot job market. And for other individuals, sometimes you have to look a little bit longer, open up your job search a little bit longer.
Al Grego:
So it's very industry specific right now.
Michelle Slater:
It is industry specific and to a certain extent based on where you live in Canada as well.
Al Grego:
Right. Yeah. Makes sense. Why is it important in this labor market to have a good candidate experience?
Michelle Slater:
It's important to keep candidates interested throughout the entire process. It's nothing more frustrating than having a great applicant that you want to hire, and all of a sudden, where do they go? Another reason is you want to attract as many qualified candidates as possible. So having a great experience will often attract more candidates. Thirdly, ensure that those quality candidates are encouraged to apply. And lastly, we care very much about our company brand and making sure that your reputation is strong. And this can be eroded really, really quickly by many different things, but candidates will talk about what the job experience was like and that candidate experience, they'll share it with their friends, family members, even on social media. And so you want to make sure your company's reputation is incredibly strong. So from start to finish, having a really great candidate experience matters.
Al Grego:
As the hiring company, what tips do you have for them?
Michelle Slater:
There's a couple of tips that I strongly recommend. The first one is stay up to date with what job seekers want in Canada. Yes, they want to be paid well, and they want to be paid fairly, but we're also finding that 20% of Canadians are looking for better benefits as a motivation for searching for a new job. So make sure that it's the pay plus the benefits that are up-to-date and reflective of what the current needs are for Canadians. The second thing is when you are interviewing someone and going through the applications, is to make sure that the individuals who are reviewing applications and doing the interview have actually been trained on how to deliver a strong quality interview, and that they've taken some training around unconscious bias. You want to make sure that there's consistency for all of the people who are interviewing for your company, and that all biases are taken off the table, whether that's based on gender or any other biases that individuals may or may not have, and that is a much more positive candidate experience.
And then the last thing is make sure your onboarding process is clear, and it's simple, and it's very straightforward. It's hard when you join a new company and whether you set up the new employee with a buddy, you've got documentation all organized. You want to make sure that the onboarding process is as seamless as possible, so the new employee feels as welcome as possible at their new company.
Al Grego:
That's great Michelle, where can folks learn more about Indeed if they wanted to?
Michelle Slater:
Visit us at indeed.com, and also I strongly encourage you to check out our leadership hub for lots of tips on hiring and attracting talent.
Al Grego:
Thank you so much for your time today, Michelle.
Michelle Slater:
Thank you.
Speaker 4:
Save the day.
Al Grego:
I'm joined by Amanda Ibrahim. She's the senior events and sponsorship specialist at Moneris. Amanda, thank you so much for joining me today.
Amanda Ibrahim:
Thanks for having me, Al.
Al Grego:
Now I hear May's calendar is jam packed, so why don't we get started? What do we have to look forward to this month?
Amanda Ibrahim:
Yes, Al. Lots on the go. Moneris will be speaking at the Payments Canada Summit in two different sessions. May 3rd, we are participating on a panel on the evolution of fraud inside and outside of payments. And on May 4th, a concurrent session on creating a more connected commute.
Al Grego:
Okay.
Amanda Ibrahim:
Folks can learn more at thesummit.ca.
Al Grego:
All right, great. Thanks. What else do you have?
Amanda Ibrahim:
On May 11th at 1:00 PM, Moneris is hosting a webinar with Ingenico, boosting customer interactions with speed, efficiency, and security. If you're interested in joining the conversation on leveraging Android terminals to deliver flexible and intuitive customer experiences, check the description of this podcast for the link to register.
Al Grego:
Perfect. What's next?
Amanda Ibrahim:
Moneris is excited to join the Startup Canada Tour as an ecosystem partner for their May 11th stop in Vancouver, BC. The Startup Canada Tour is a five stop national opportunity to connect with the Canadian entrepreneurship ecosystem, stopping in Whitehorse, Halifax, Vancouver, Calgary, and Ontario, and they'll be bringing together early stage entrepreneurs to build out their network, learn from industry experts, and drive their businesses forward. If anyone's interested in registering, you can at www.startupcanada.ca.
Al Grego:
All right. What else do you have?
Amanda Ibrahim:
Al, as I said, it's a busy month, so we'll also be at the Cabo Annual Conference from May 8th to 10th. The Federation of Canadian Municipalities and Annual Conference in Trade Show from May 25th to 28th, and the Retail Council of Canada Store 23 Conference from May 30th to 31st.
Al Grego:
And finally.
Amanda Ibrahim:
And finally, Moneris is also sponsoring the Forum Spring E-series from May 16th to June 15th, and Vancouver Board of Trade Digital Transformation Workshop on May 25th.
Al Grego:
Wow, you weren't lying. That is a jam packed month.
Amanda Ibrahim:
And that's all I have for you, Al.
Al Grego:
I think that's enough. Thank you so much for your time today, Amanda.
Amanda Ibrahim:
Thanks for having me, Al.
Al Grego:
That's all we have for this month. I hope you found this episode informative. If you haven't already, check out Moneris' other award-winning podcast. Yes, we are open. We're halfway through season four. Here's a little taste. Success in business doesn't come without moments of struggle, moments when you had to face your challenges head on. When you overcome these moments, which you're left with is not just success. You're also left with a story, a story of how you did it, a story to inform, inspire, and be proud of. At yes, we are open. It's our business to tell these stories, and we're kind of good at it. Subscribe now to season four of the award-winning, yes, we are open. Available wherever you get your podcasts.
Jacqueline Campbell:
If you haven't already, you can subscribe to this podcast. And yes, we are open wherever you get your podcast.
Al Grego:
If you'd like to support the show, share this podcast with your network or review us on Spotify or Apple Podcast. And finally, if you have a payment related question you'd like to submit to one of our experts, you can email us at podcast@moneris.com.
Jacqueline Campbell:
Join us again next month for more expert insight and data to help you grow your business.
Al Grego:
Thank you so much for co-hosting, Jacqueline.
Jacqueline Campbell:
Thanks Al.
Al Grego:
On behalf of Jacqueline, myself, and the rest of Moneris, thank you for listening to Shop Talk. Talk again in June.