It’s that time of year again! Time to get gather with family and celebrate the holidays. It’s a festive time, but it’s also a time when people feel their most charitable, so this month we’re talking about Charities and Not-For-Profit Businesses. How do these types of business differ from conventional for-profit businesses? What are charities doing to become more ‘digital’ in an increasingly cashless society? Al speaks with Mark Jordan, Managing Director, tiptap Foundation about an interesting solution for charities looking for cashless and contactless payment options.
It’s that time of year again! Time to get gather with family and celebrate the holidays. It’s a festive time, but it’s also a time when people feel their most charitable, so this month we’re talking about Charities and Not-For-Profit Businesses.
How do these types of business differ from conventional for-profit businesses? What are charities doing to become more ‘digital’ in an increasingly cashless society?
Al speaks with Mark Jordan, Managing Director, tiptap Foundation about an interesting solution for charities looking for cashless and contactless payment options.
Also in this episode:
Chapters:
Al Grego:
Coming up on Shop Talk.
Mark Jordan:
Tiptap really exists at the intersection of those three challenges, right? Needs going up. Fundraising or donations I should say are flat, stable, and cash is just decreasing. So simply put, we replace that cash in person, that's our sweet spot for our solution.
Al Grego:
Hello everyone. I'm Al Grego.
Amanda Ibrahim:
And I'm Amanda Ibrahim.
Al Grego:
And this is the December 2022 edition of Shop Talk with Moneris. Welcome to Shop Talk podcast, Amanda.
Amanda Ibrahim:
Thank you very much, Al. It's great to be here.
Al Grego:
It's great to have you.
Amanda Ibrahim:
So you've had a big month.
Al Grego:
I have, and I'm feeling very grateful.
Amanda Ibrahim:
I'm pretty sure I know why, but why don't you share?
Al Grego:
Well, Amanda, as you know, on the last Shop Talk, I announced that our other podcast, Yes, We Are Open, had been nominated for a couple of Canadian podcast awards.
Amanda Ibrahim:
Yes. That was a nice surprise.
Al Grego:
It was, and the bigger surprise was that we actually won the Canadian Podcast Award for outstanding business series.
Amanda Ibrahim:
That's amazing. Congratulations.
Al Grego:
Thank you. Couldn't have done it without the help of our amazing team at Moneris, obviously, and most importantly, our listeners.
Amanda Ibrahim:
That's certainly a cause for celebration. So what's this month's theme?
Al Grego:
Well, since it is the holiday season and everyone is getting into the spirit of giving, I thought we'd take a look at charities and not-for-profits this month.
Amanda Ibrahim:
Tis the season, right?
Al Grego:
Exactly.
Amanda Ibrahim:
Did you know that Moneris, in addition to vacation, we get a volunteer day every year?
Al Grego:
Of course. And a couple of weeks ago, my team spent an amazing afternoon at Second Harvest sorting food for food banks.
Amanda Ibrahim:
I saw that. It looks like you guys had a great time.
Al Grego:
We did. It was nice to get together as a team in person and work together. In support of such a great organization. We helped sort over 1800 pounds of food.
Amanda Ibrahim:
That's very impressive.
Al Grego:
So does your team have anything planned?
Amanda Ibrahim:
Yes. As a matter of fact, later this week we're volunteering at Holiday Helpers, sorting and wrapping gifts for families with young children living in low income situations.
Al Grego:
Amazing. Both are such great organizations working towards great causes.
Amanda Ibrahim:
Agreed. Listeners of this podcast know that we've been proud sponsors of Second Harvest all year round and Holiday Helpers provides such an important service this time of year.
Al Grego:
They certainly do.
Amanda Ibrahim:
So what do you have lined up for this episode?
Al Grego:
I've got a great lineup this month, starting with our featured interview with Mark Jordan from Tiptap to talk about how they're helping charities in an increasingly cashless society.
Amanda Ibrahim:
They've got such a cool product and so simple too.
Al Grego:
Agreed. Then our regular visit from Shawn McCormick, who's coming on to share some data about Giving Tuesday.
Amanda Ibrahim:
I love that initiative.
Al Grego:
And finally in the Ask The Expert segment, I speak with Stephen Mattis from RBC about not-for-profit businesses.
Amanda Ibrahim:
That is a solid lineup.
Al Grego:
All killer and no filler. So let's begin with my chat with Mark Jordan.
Speaker 4:
Featured interview.
Al Grego:
I'm joined today by Mark Jordan. He's a community giving sector lead at Tiptap. Mark, thank you so much for joining me today.
Mark Jordan:
Thank you very much for having me.
Al Grego:
Mark, let's start with the obvious. What does Tiptap do?
Mark Jordan:
We're a touchless giving and touchless payment solution. What makes us unique is we are completely standalone, meaning you do not need to attach us to a tablet, a phone, any kind of infrastructure for that matter. You simply plug in our device and you're up and fundraising or collecting payments in seconds.
Al Grego:
I'm really excited to talk to you today because I've actually seen your devices in action. My family were out in Newfoundland this summer on vacation and we were touring Cathedral in St. John's and I noticed the Tiptap devices where you would also, you could donate your money for the church. There was also a couple of Tiptap, what do you call them?
Mark Jordan:
Displays.
Al Grego:
Displays. And it was so easy because in this, especially with the pandemic, no one's carrying money around, but it was just you use your credit card or your debit card, you tap. There was a couple, I think it was a $5 do donation and a $10 donation and it works.
Mark Jordan:
Amazing. Yeah, actually faith-based giving is a major area of focus for us as you might imagine. So that's great that you saw us in action.
Al Grego:
Yes, and I was very excited because I knew about you guys, but I hadn't seen one yet out in the wild. That was my first time seeing it and it was very cool. So how long has Tiptap been around?
Mark Jordan:
So Tiptap has been around for just over four years now. Our founder, Chris Greenfield, actually had the eureka moment in a moment of empathy. He was looking to tip someone in a hospitality setting and had no cash on him. As is more and more the trend these days. So he actually asked the individual, "What if I came up with a button that you could wear that would allow you to actually collect tips from people just being able to tap that?" And in that moment Tiptap was born and since that time, just over the last four years and a bit, we've helped now closing in on almost 300 organizations, literally thousands of programs across primarily North America. So amazing impact. We're really helping those who are helping others.
Al Grego:
In order to have one of these, you need a power source, I guess, you need a connection to the internet?
Mark Jordan:
So you need a power source that the devices all can get plugged in, which is the preferred method. You can also run them off of battery, high capacity battery, if you're out in a, let's say on a golf course where you're not going to run an extension cord to to the device, right? And they all run off of the cell network, so there's no wifi, there's no kind of trying to connect with an existing internet connection. They literally run off the same technology as your cell phone does.
Al Grego:
And then the funds just automatically get deposited into your business account?
Mark Jordan:
Correct.
Al Grego:
Okay.
Mark Jordan:
So we work with Moneris in Canada to do that. That's how we connect our devices to ultimately the organization's bank accounts that we work with.
Al Grego:
Now, I'm assuming that there's a safeguard to prevent somebody from accidentally double tapping or something and getting charged twice or multiple times?
Mark Jordan:
Yeah, absolutely. So from a donor experience perspective, it's the same experience as when you walk into a retail store. So let's say you were in your local Tim Hortons, you had your card in hand or your mobile wallet, you hold your card to the device, there's a beep once it's recognized, and then another beep a couple of seconds later. So it is an intentional behavior that's required, similar to when you're at cash in a retail store, which makes it again, harder to make an accidental tap or double tap in an accidental manner.
Al Grego:
And of course the amount that you're donating is clearly marked on the device so that you can't enter more or less. It's whatever the device shows. What I noticed at this cathedral in St. John's, for each level donation, there was another device.
Mark Jordan:
Yeah, that's correct. Every single device is what you see is what you tap and that does a couple of things. In a donation scenario, there is no kind of humming and hawing, "What will I donate?" It's literally what you see is what you're donating. In a payment scenario, you are able to significantly line bust as we like to say. Because again, there's no kind of standing in line and punching in numbers into a point of sale. It's paying $10 for that beer or you're paying $15 for that T-shirt. Right? It's a very quick, simple three to four seconds to take to make the transaction.
Al Grego:
What's the highest amount that you can do? Is it 250? Because that's the most you can tap.
Mark Jordan:
Yeah, 250 is the tap limit and we absolutely have used denominations all the way up to 250. Some of our partners have been using our devices at things like galas and luncheons where, again, the fundraising price point and the audience is that much higher. So imagine popping a balloon for $250 to see if you won a flight that Air Canada might have donated, those types of events.
Al Grego:
Are you based in Canada?
Mark Jordan:
We are a Canadian company, a Canadian FinTech. We're actually proudly based out of Burlington, Ontario, which is where Chris grew up. And we work with primarily clients, as I said in Canada, the US, we've done a little bit of work out of the UK and Ireland as well.
Al Grego:
No, I mean I can really see the potential here for charities and for not-for-profits, but is there an application here as well just for like a for-profit business and what would that be?
Mark Jordan:
Yeah, absolutely. So we have really three modes, so to speak, tap to give, tap to pay and tap to tip. So in a more for-profit scenario, you could see using Tiptap at a retail counter for example, or in a stadium or in an arena to pay for drinks, to pay for merchandise, to pay for any items for that matter. We're actually working with Maple Leaf Sports & Entertainment right now where they're doing a bag check when you come into the Scotia Bank arena, and that is a tap to pay scenario. On the tap to tip side, using a tap to tip in a hotel scenario or at a bar. Again, very simple integration where you don't have to now reconfigure your point of sale. You can easily track and disperse the funds using our online dashboard. So it makes it really easy to use for not only donations, but certainly for those for-profit scenarios as well.
Al Grego:
What are some of the trends you see kind of in the charity sector?
Mark Jordan:
There's three macro trends that I think Tiptap is really playing a role to help with. The first is the need is only increasing. So I think a stat that came out from Ipsos recently was that one in five Canadians actually intend to use a charitable service in the coming months, which is quite a shocking stat when you think about it. Giving has remained fairly stable according to other research from Nanos, which at first glance would be that that's great news, right? It's not declining. The challenge is the need is going up and then what's also happening is cash use is continuing to decline. So it dropped to 10% of all transactions in 2021 according to Payments Canada. So Tiptap really exists at the intersection of those three challenges. Right? Needs going up, fundraising or donations I should say are flat, stable, and cash is just decreasing. So simply put, we replace that cash in person, that's our sweet spot for our solution and we're helping organizations to raise more because they need more.
We're starting to see with some organizations the impact of Tiptap as part of their total fundraising campaign. So for example, Salvation Army Canada, who last year had a goal of $20 million total across the country. We represented 11% of that with Tiptap. So we're starting to reach this point where we're significantly impacting organizations fundraising, not just sort of in the even hundreds of thousands. We're now in the seven digits, which is pretty amazing. One of the things that we talk about a lot is the fact that really, again, Tiptap is an enabler. If you're investing at a dollar in a Tiptap solution, you should be seeing four to $8 returned. So it's really a high impact, low risk solution to add to your donation fundraising ecosystem. That is, again, it's not a silver bullet, it's not a magic wand that's going to immediately solve all problems, but it's going to give you the opportunity to raise funds in a way that maybe you weren't before and capture some of that declining cash.
Al Grego:
And the barrier to entry is really low.
Mark Jordan:
It's extremely low, you could have a couple of devices out with a few displays, and we're actually seeing at the community giving level some of the greatest impact in terms of that ROI that I was talking about 48 times. It's actually being seen at the community giving level, meaning organizations that might take five or six devices, but they're raising enough, they're paying for themselves almost 16 times over in some cases.
Al Grego:
You told me earlier that your website was just relaunched. Is that where you would guide people for more information?
Mark Jordan:
Yeah, twofold. So definitely the website, which was just relaunched a week that we're having this conversation, and we also have relaunched our e-commerce platform, making it even easier for people who are in our organizations who are looking to pick up devices, might be for the upcoming holiday season. They might say, "Well, we might have missed the boat." You actually can get devices turned around very, very quickly by going to our online store. So yeah, either visiting tiptappay.com or shop.tiptappay.com for that information.
Al Grego:
Thank you so much for your time today, Mark.
Mark Jordan:
No problem.
Mat Belanger:
At Moneris, we empower merchants to keep doing business their way while we handle the payment processing our way. What way would that be? The safe way, the always connected way, the awesome integrated tools to help you make more money way. We know your business never stops, so you deserve products that never stop working. That's why we are committed to providing our merchants with a payment partner that works just as hard as they do to make every sale. Moneris proud partner of small Canadian business.
Speaker 4:
By the numbers.
Al Grego:
I'm joined once again by Sean McCormick, Director of Business Development for Data at Moneris. Sean, welcome back to the podcast.
Sean McCormick:
As always, all it's pleasure my friend.
Al Grego:
Today, I mean we're going to talk a little bit about Giving Tuesday and just to give a bit of a background, I mean we all know about Black Friday and Cyber Monday, but maybe not as many people have heard of Giving Tuesday. That's the Tuesday after Cyber Monday, and actually I didn't know about this until today. It was started in Canada back in 2013 and now it's in more than 80 countries worldwide and in 2021 over $43 million were donated online in Canada on Giving Tuesday. So we're talking about this, I mean, it's a little too soon to get numbers for this year's Giving Tuesday since it happened this past week, but we could always use the last few years as predictors. So that's why you're here. Sean, in your opinion, what can we expect for this Giving Tuesday?
Sean McCormick:
Well, Al, whenever I'm on your show, we always talk about how unpredictable and non-linear consumer spending patterns have been the last couple of years and the patterns on giving Tuesday were no different. In 2021, we always talk about growth year over year, so what was volume like one year compared to the same period one year ago? Well, in 2021, Giving Tuesday last year, we saw a 37% decline in dollar volume processed in this segment versus the same day in 2020. So a total of 37% fewer donations at the end of the day, that's a steep decline. Again, looking at the broader picture and how non-linear consumer spending patterns have been over the last three years, that doesn't surprise me.
If I had to put my prediction hat on for a split second, I think that there's going to be headwinds this year again, just given the disposable income that Canadians have at the moment. There's a perception, and we've researched this with our partners at Angus Reid. People think that they don't have as much money today as they did yesterday. That may or may not be the case, but that is the perception and unfortunately when it comes to the charitable giving sector, which by the way is my background, that was one of my very first business development jobs was in the charitable giving space.
Al Grego:
Oh really?
Sean McCormick:
These organizations are at the mercy of disposable income a lot of times. People want to do good, but they also want to do good within their means and 37% decline year over year last year. I wouldn't expect that that's going to go down another 37%. I think that if the drop happened between 2020 and 2021, maybe that will normalize and maybe that's flat.
If it goes back up, it will be because there directionally was an increase in average transaction size last year. So that was the nugget last year, the positive nugget for charities across Canada is that the average transaction size in 2020 was $105, the average transaction size for donation on giving Tuesday in 2021 was 113. So we're talking four or 5% increase. So that's good and that's significant. The trick for charities is going to be to engage the donors more effectively because clearly there weren't as many donors and engaged last year and there's always one of a charities core strategies is donor engagement and hopefully they'll do a good job of that this year. Should know the top three most popular charitable organizations to give to in 2021 were sports and wellness, number one, hospitals, number two, and wildlife in the environment, number three. Those are very different than what they were in one year previous.
Previous to that it was humanitarian aid, sports and wellness, and disease research and prevention. That was 2020. So in today's environment, I think that there's a good chance that you will see humanitarian aid probably popular. We see all around us where the cost of living is driving more and more people into homelessness. And I got to think that Canadians, we have big hearts and I have to think that we want to help those in need, and I think that that's been clear for all of us to see in the news. And I wouldn't be surprised to see the humanitarian aid back near the top again this year.
Al Grego:
Oh, for sure. Well, I appreciate all the time you've given to this podcast this year, Sean. Thank you so much. And here's looking to an upward trending 2023. I appreciate everything you've done for us this year. Looking forward to next year, have a great holiday.
Sean McCormick:
Positive vibes and positive trends being sent your way, Al.
Al Grego:
Excellent. Thank you so much.
Sean McCormick:
Thank you.
Speaker 4:
Ask an expert.
Al Grego:
I'm joined today by Stephen Mattis. He's the vice president of commercial banking at RBC. Stephen, thank you for joining me today.
Stephen Mattis:
Well, glad to join you, Al. Happy to chat today.
Al Grego:
The theme for this month is charities and not-for-profit because it is the season to be charitable. So you're our expert today on not-for-profit businesses. You're going to explain to me what the difference is between a regular business like a sole proprietorship or no corporation and a not-for-profit in terms of setting it up to begin. So off the top high level, what is the main difference between a regular business and a not-for-profit?
Stephen Mattis:
I think the main difference, the primary difference is the motivation or goal of an organization and where not-for-profits and charities differ is their main goal is to raise funds, but then take those funds and put them into the community or put them back in this community or a cause that is their mission and their driving towards, it could be a shelter, a food bank, or many different things. And so really their role isn't to really turn a profit, certainly to be profitable, but take those surplus funds and drive them back into the community.
Al Grego:
So setting it up, I mean, I imagine even just setting up for taxes and stuff, it'll be a lot different because you're not supposed to show profits. So at setup time, what's the main difference there? Is it just different paperwork you file or?
Stephen Mattis:
Yeah, really, Al, is not much difference. You come in, it really depends if you're a not-for-profit or a charity, there's a little bit of a variance there. So not all not-for-profits are charities, but all charities are not-for-profit. And basically it's determined by if the organization receives donations and if they're registered with the CRA as a registered charity, then they're a true charity and there's kind of different forms to fill out when you come to the bank for that one. And then there's not-for-profit who aren't a registered charity and those could be associations or societies or lodges. And the paperwork's a little bit more simple, but either way, quite easy to set up accounts at RDC and get you set up with whatever you need both for the accounts and also digital solutions to help you move money back and forth as well.
Al Grego:
Interesting. Do you have statistics in terms of how many businesses are started each year and how many of those would be not-for-profit as opposed to for-profit?
Stephen Mattis:
I don't know that number, but what I do know is that when I came into this market segment probably eight years ago, my eyes were really opened in terms of the size and scope of the not-for-profit sector right across Canada. It's truly amazing and actually makes up a very large part of our gross domestic product as well. And there's more people employed in the not-for-profit sector than in the auto sector, so a really big important piece of our economy.
Al Grego:
Couple of examples for not-for-profit are obviously charities, and you already mentioned associations. What are some other examples of a not-for-profit type business?
Stephen Mattis:
It is such a broad sector and you can think of some large international relief organizations. There's unions, on the public sector side, of course there's school boards, hospitals, colleges, all of those pieces too. But just a broad sector of organizations that don't have profit as a motive and their focus is giving back to the community.
Al Grego:
Are you seeing any sort of changes to the not-for-profit segment in terms of technological advancements or anything like that that we can look forward to?
Stephen Mattis:
Yeah, I think over the last couple years and especially through COVID, charities have really had to take a look at their operating models, try and become as efficient as possible, try to find a way to connect with people in different ways to make sure that they continue to be engaged with their cause and what their purpose. And so there really has been a lot of advancements with digital applications and that extends into their banking as well, just to ensure that that flow of revenue can come in consistently even when there are interruptions. And so we've seen a lot of that over the last two years and really move forward many charities in their digital journeys and allow them to keep revenue flowing and keep their organizations open for those who need them over those years.
Al Grego:
I mean, one of the challenges, I know not a lot of people carrying cash around these days, so when you have, for example, a Poppy Drive or Salvation Army coming into the holidays, there's been a few advancements there too.
Stephen Mattis:
Absolutely. And we're super excited about those as well. We're always looking for ways that we can help our clients achieve their goals, achieve their missions, do it effectively, safely with good governance. And there's been some development, and one that's still recently is a partnership that we've had through Moneris and Tiptap that's been exciting and be able to offer that to our clients. There's quite a few clients where that can make a lot of sense to have that opportunity to receive donations that maybe they wouldn't have received otherwise just by having that technology available where it is 24 hours a day, seven days a week, and a quick hit with people going by, as you mentioned, cashless society, you miss those opportunities. But Tiptap does accept all credit cards, debit cards, and so, love to be able to give advice where we can bring a solution that actually increases revenue streams for charities. So yeah, great solution.
Al Grego:
Okay, so if one of our listeners has an idea to start a business and it is a nonprofit or charitable business, where could they learn more at RBC?
Stephen Mattis:
Yeah, if they just go into rbc.com, they can follow through the not-for-profit fees and actually all of our commercial banking teams are listed under those categories. So you'll be able to locate us if you're in the GTR region just under not-for-profit at rbc.com and reach out to one of the advisors and we'll make sure that you get to the home of Best Fit that we can look after you and get you set up and operating in a great way for your charity or not-for-profit.
Al Grego:
That's great. Thank you so much, Stephen, for your time today.
Stephen Mattis:
Oh, thank you, Al, appreciate it.
Speaker 4:
Save the day.
Al Grego:
Okay, Amanda, let's talk about this December's calendar. It's probably a bit of a quieter calendar this month, I hope.
Amanda Ibrahim:
Yes. A little quiet. Everyone's getting ready for the holidays, I think.
Al Grego:
So what do we have on the calendar?
Amanda Ibrahim:
Moneris is a proud sponsor of the annual Distillery Winter Village. It's taking place in the historic distillery district in downtown Toronto, so make sure you check that out. It's open from December 17th to December 23rd.
Al Grego:
Okay. That's always a fun time to go over there. What else do you have?
Amanda Ibrahim:
We have a busy month for eCommerce North. The Holiday Innovator Challenge will wrap up on December 6th with a pitch competition where the finalists will pitch their companies for a chance to win one of $5,000 grants.
Al Grego:
Oh, excellent. Anything else?
Amanda Ibrahim:
We also have the third cohort of eCommerce North Accelerator graduating on December 13th, which is exciting. If you have a startup with a mission that matters or know someone who does, check out ecommercenorth.ca to find out more about how you can apply for the next cohort.
Al Grego:
Great. Thank you so much, Amanda.
Amanda Ibrahim:
Thank you, Al.
Al Grego:
And that's all we have for this month. I hope you found this episode informative. Before we sign off, I'd like to let you know that season three of the award-winning Yes, We Are Open podcast is now complete.
Amanda Ibrahim:
I bet you can't get enough of saying, "award-winning."
Al Grego:
I really can't. Anyway, if you haven't listened to the award-winning-
Amanda Ibrahim:
One more time?
Al Grego:
... Yes, We Are Open podcast. You're missing out. You can binge all three seasons right now. Here's a teaser.
I have a question for you. What do the following businesses have in common? A cannabis store, an athletic wear brand, dog biscuits, a tech startup, a travel agency, hairdressers, a kid's dentist, and a manufacturer of silent boots? Of course, the answer is they all have stories of struggle and perseverance to tell and they're all coming up on season three of Yes, We Are Open podcast. Episode one, drops Monday, October 3rd. Subscribe now wherever you get your podcasts.
Amanda Ibrahim:
If you haven't already, you can subscribe to this podcast and the award-winning-
Al Grego:
Nailed it.
Amanda Ibrahim:
... Yes, We Are Open podcast wherever you get your podcasts.
Al Grego:
If you'd like to support the show, share this podcast with your network or reviews on Spotify or Apple Podcasts. And finally, if you have a payment related question you'd like to submit to one of our experts, you can email us at podcast@moneris.com.
Amanda Ibrahim:
Join us again next month for more expert insights and data to help you grow your business.
Al Grego:
Thank you so much for co-hosting, Amanda.
Amanda Ibrahim:
Anytime, Al.
Al Grego:
And on behalf of Amanda, myself, and the rest of Moneris, have a safe and happy holiday season and a happy new year. Thank you for listening to Shop Talk. We'll talk again in January 2023.